Dosage auto-calculation in apps

48 posts, 25 contributors

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JenC DAFNE Graduate
St Vincent's Dublin
4 posts

Unfair to direct frustrations at the site admin - to have an app at all is such an improvement on how things used to be. I have Type 1 diabetes 20 years and really appreciate advances such as this which make life that little bit easier - like carrying around tatty diaries in your handbag.

Yes, the auto calc function was very useful - but a simple calculation can be done (like you would have to have done previously!)

Annette Bell DAFNE Graduate
Sheffield Teaching Hospitals
55 posts

JenC said:
Unfair to direct frustrations at the site admin - to have an app at all is such an improvement on how things used to be. I have Type 1 diabetes 20 years and really appreciate advances such as this which make life that little bit easier - like carrying around tatty diaries in your handbag.

Yes, the auto calc function was very useful - but a simple calculation can be done (like you would have to have done previously!)



If you read my post properly, you'll see that I wasn't having a go at site admin, it was a copy of an e-mail which I sent to the MHRA.

marke Site Administrator
South East Kent PCT
634 posts

Hi Annette,
Sorry but you letter enforces the fact that the app was being used to make decisions on insulin doses. Since insulin is considered a 'serious' drug i.e it can easily kill you, the fact people are saying they use it to make judgements like driving will just convince the MHRA they have made the right decision. Most drug companies invest large amounts of money into this kind of thing, not because it is hugely complicated but because of the potential consequences if the dose suggested is wrong. Thus the calculations are subject to lots of regulations and the drug companies all have large liability insurance to cover 'accidents'.
That's not so say I agree with the MHRA in any way, all we were doing is implementing a calculation that the user now has to do manually and is more likely to get wrong. However if we do get it wrong we can only blame ourselves and sadly in the current world thats all the MHRA care about. Your Diabetes Nurse may well say she disagrees 'unofficially', however her CCG will not say that they will support the MHRA for fear of being sued by patients.
Cynical me ? No, I have to work with people like the MHRA and NHS. I know how they work. Sorry.

Graeme Skipper DAFNE Graduate
Waitemata DHB, Auckland
1 post

I have just yesterday innocently updated my app, and was really surprised at the removal of the auto calc feature. Is there any way of removing the update and going back to previous version?

Simon Site Administrator
Sheffield Teaching Hospitals
543 posts

Hi Graeme,

Unfortunately not, there is no way to go backwards with mobile apps. Sorry about that.

Thanks to all who have been understanding about this issue, it really helps in spite of the fact that others have been less supportive and some even abusive on the App Store reviews.

DavidBlackman DAFNE Graduate
Diabetes Australia-Vic, Melbourne, Victoria
6 posts

Hi Simon,
Really disappointed by the MHRA decision, what a bunch of Pricks! These sorts of apps are an absolute life changer for us Type 1s and our medical teams and the removal of this function, which is available on a lot of other apps, significantly reduces its usability and makes our lives just a bit harder, again.

Well done for all the work you and others have put into this app, as you can see and probably already know it is appreciated by many.

Any suggestions from anyone on who we might be raise the issue with to see if it can be changed?

David, Melbourne Australia Mad

Theodore Taylor DAFNE Graduate
Cambridgeshire
1 post

Hi All,

I'd really like to get the app cleared by MHRA. Would a kickstarter help in any way?

Im sure we'd all be willing to give 50 quid to get this feature back.

Perhaps i am missing the point.

Either way, thanks to the whole team for making a great app (even without the calc)

carolinapast... DAFNE Graduate
Lewisham and Greenwich NHS Trust
1 post

There is an App called Insulin Pro which is basically a dose calculator. You just have to adjust your settings and you're good to go Smile

Politikaal DAFNE Graduate
Queensland Diabetes Centre, Brisbane, QLD
6 posts

Hi Carolina, Yes, I have had a look on the App Store and there is a plethora of apps available with automatic dose calculation. I have been experimenting with RapidCalc as was recommended by another member last week and am quite impressed. I guess these apps are developed in other countries that aren't subject to such restrictive nanny state bureaucracies. I don't want to be promoting other apps on this forum, one thing that none of them have is the automatic upload and contact with our DAFNE community. The auto calculation really does make a difference for me though; anything to make diabetic life just that little bit easier is always going to be a plus. Again, I hope our hardworking team can find a way to get around this.

bejt1 DAFNE Graduate
Northumbria Healthcare Trust
3 posts

I have just updated my DAFNE ONLINE APP and discovered that the auto calculation feature is no longer available. It appears that a decision to remove the facility has been made without user consultation and that users are now dissatisfied with the app.
I don't agree with the reason given for the removal of the auto calculation as it does not credit the user for the interaction with the app in setting targets and ratios in response to historical diary data but appears to insult users by suggesting that the app is used to make decisions about insulin dosage on a purely mechanistic process. Obviously DAFNE cannot be used without some understanding of the calculation process and the auto calculation simply speeded up the dose calculation by allowing users to more conveniently determine their dose once the settings had been entered. In addition the automatic uploading of the data to DAFNEONLINE created a convenient diary record which I found very useful when visiting a clinic.
The question I now need to consider is: why should I continue to use DAFNEONLINE as it has now been reduced to a carb counter and diary, should I look for another app, or will the auto calculation be reinstated?
I have always been hopeless at keeping a paper diary but enter about six readings a day into DAFNEONLINE for my clinician to observe, the loss of this facility is a backwards and negative decision which I feel has been made by people who don't understand to use of the app.
Please put it right Embarassed